In this podcast episode, Emily interview Lauri Lutes, a fourth-year PhD student at Oregon State University and single mother. Lauri’s stipend is equivalent to the local living wage for just one adult, yet she supports herself and her daughter on it without using student loans. Lauri details how she makes ends meet by taking advantage of every possible university and community benefit, such as subsidized and free childcare, food assistance, and recreation and arts scholarships. Lauri additionally serves her community by advocating for graduate student parents on two university boards.

Links mentioned in episode

• Tax Center for PhDs-in-Training
• Volunteer as a Guest for the Podcast
• MIT Living Wage Calculator

Teaser

Lauri (00:00): My daughter was four when I was looking at graduate schools, and so I, I was looking at the family resources available, and I was surprised to find the Oregon State University actually offers quite a few resources to their students to help them be successful, and I’ve definitely taken advantage of those things.

Introduction

Emily (00:20): Welcome to the personal Finance for PhDs podcast, a Higher Education in Personal finance. I’m your host, Emily Roberts. This is season two, episode one, and today my guest is Lauri Lutes, a fourth year PhD student at Oregon State University. Lauri is a single parent to an elementary school age child whom she supports on her graduate stipend. We discussed the numerous on-campus and community resources that Lauri has enrolled in, such as subsidized childcare, food assistance, and recreational scholarships. This is a discussion that will benefit anyone who is struggling to make ends meet on a stipend. Without further ado, here’s my interview with Lauri Lutes.

Please Introduce Yourself

Emily (01:02): Well, welcome. I’m here with Lauri Lutes, my guest for our Money Story interview today, and we are going to be discussing making ends meet, or at least attempting to make ends meet as a parent in graduate school, especially, um, of an, of an older child, and in particular as a single parent. So, Lauri, welcome to the podcast. Um, please tell us a little bit more, more about yourself and about your family.

Lauri (01:27): Yeah, so, um, my name is Lauri Lutes and I’m a PhD student at Oregon State University. And, um, my research is to study viruses on, um, sweet cherry trees. So that’s the main reason why I am, have put myself in this situation. Um, I have a 7-year-old daughter who will be eight next week actually, and I am currently a single mom. So, as you can imagine, juggling all of that, um, there are some struggles.

What is your current annual income and expenses?

Emily (02:01): Yeah, I mean, I, I can’t even imagine, first of all the, the time challenges to being, having such important roles, obviously as a parent and also trying to finish your PhD, but we’re gonna focus on the financial side of things today. So yeah, let’s start off by talking about your income and your expenses. So what is your current income?

Lauri (02:22): So my income comes from a graduate stipend. Um, students in my program, unless you are performing poorly, are pretty much insured, some sort of an assistantship. So I’ve either had a teaching assistantship or a research assistant assistantship, um, the whole time I’ve been here and I make about $24,000 a year.

Emily (02:43): Compare that to what are your, what, what are your current expenses for the year?

Lauri (02:49): So my, my current expenses probably exceed that. A very modest estimate would be somewhere between 27 and $30,000. Um, but that, that is really just the bare minimum of paying rent and, um, you know, not having a car payment and also, um, not taking into consideration some supplemental income that I get from food assistance programs and things like that.

Emily (03:16): Yeah, we’ll definitely be talking more about that a little bit later on. And I just wanna give the listeners a little bit of context. So I looked up what the living wage is in, um, Benton County, and, um, so for, I, I really like this tool, it’s, it’s livingwage.mit.edu. So those of you who are looking at moving or something maybe for graduate school or for your postdoc, check this out by uh county. It tells you what living wages are for different family units. And so for one adult, um, with one child in Benton County, um, they suggest a living wage of $51,000 before tax 41 or about 42,000 after tax. So, I mean, you can tell <laugh> from the numbers that Lauri’s throwing out that she is living close to the bone here. Um, and so we’re certainly gonna learn more about her, her strategies and why she’s, why she’s chosen to make this work. 

What benefits do you receive and how did you find these benefits?

Emily (04:11): Um, so we have your income and your expenses. And so you did mention, you know, you’re receiving some kind of assistance from OSU right? Some support, um, for yourself as a student and as a parent. So can you tell me more about what you found, uh, the benefits that you’ve been receiving and, and how you found out about them and enrolled in them?

Lauri (04:32): Sure. So when I was looking at different graduate schools, one thing I looked at, because I had a child at the time, I’ve been at Oregon State for, um, this is my fourth year now. So my daughter was four when I was looking at graduate schools. And so I, I was looking at the family resources available and I was surprised to find actually the Oregon State University actually offers, um, quite a few resources to their students to help them be successful. And I’ve definitely taken advantage of those things. So the two main ones that, um, I’ve taken advantage of are the childcare subsidy. So there are, um, student fees that are pulled together along with some, um, donor funding that supports a, a childcare stipend that pays up to 50% of childcare, which is for, um, children before they’re in school. And then once they’re eligible to be, um, in kindergarten where they can be in public school and not in full-time childcare. Um, even if you have before care or aftercare costs, the stipend can also be contributed to that. And so when we, uh, first moved, my daughter was able to use, we were able to use that to pay for her childcare before she was in school. And now that she’s in school, I receive the subsidy to help pay for her, um, aftercare program.

Emily (05:57): Yeah, that sounds, yeah, lemme just, just interrupt you there for a second. That sounds like really great that that’s being offered, especially because, you know, childcare isn’t just what’s, you know, during the, the hours of public school, like you need more time at work than that. So that’s really great that it extends beyond, um, beyond kindergarten. Um, I wanna go back to what you said that you were comparing what was being offered, um, by the different universities that you were applying to or admitted to. Did you find that this was, um, typical or, or did it really stand out to you as, as more than what other places were offering?

Lauri (06:31): Yeah, definitely more rare. Um, I didn’t, I was pretty much set on going to graduate school in the Pacific Northwest, so I didn’t thoroughly investigate a lot of other universities. Um, but it, it’s more rare to have this, uh, sort of stipend available to students in my experience. Um, and also because I’ve done research since then due to my different, uh, involvement with the Family resource Center, which I’ll talk about later probably. Um, but it’s, it’s more of a rare thing that a university has this sort of assistance and that it’s, um, and that it covers up to 50%. Like that’s pretty substantial as well.

Emily (07:13): Yeah. Please continue with what was the second benefit?

Lauri (07:16): Sure. So the second benefit, um, which you, uh, kind of hit the nail on the head with is that, you know, having assistance for non-school hours is another huge issue. Um, because being a student, there are many things that you need to do, um, outside of the, the school day for your child <laugh>, um, even up to like five o’clock or even in the evening sometimes. And so Oregon State also has two childcare facilities that are just a drop in, um, childcare where it is free, um, for up to three hours per day. And these are mostly offered in the evening and weekends. And so I think the hours on the weekends are something like 10:00 AM to 7:00 PM or you can go and drop your child off for three hours on the weekend and have free childcare while you’re getting work done or going to a conference or working out. One of the childcare facilities is actually at the recreation center.

Emily (08:15): I am like blown away by this <laugh>. Is there any kind of like limit on it, like a number of hours per week you’re allowed to use it?

Lauri (08:22): Um, there’s not, it’s just a three hours per day and, um, it is a first come first serve basis. And so the students who, um, are working there, student workers who, um, are the childcare providers, but a lot of them, it’s also a great experience for them because they’re students from, you know, child development or education related fields. And so they’re getting some hands on experience doing that. Um, but the, so there’s only a certain number of students and really they’re most limited by space. So the, the thing that it’s kind of first come, first serve, which I’ve only ran into one situation where instead of going to the childcare facility and the recreation center, I had to go to the one in the library. But, um, typically there, there is enough room and, um, I haven’t really run into that problem. So I, I think the, the folks that oversee that are, um, knowledgeable enough to know what the peak times are and know when to offer the hours and have that worked out to where it’s still a reliable resource for student parents.

What is your daily routine like? Is your advisor supportive?

Emily (09:31): Are you, um, are you an experimentalist? Are you in the lab or what’s your kind of day-to-day like?

Lauri (09:37): So my day-to-day, my work is, it ebbs and flows for sure. Um, so the first couple years of my work I was surveying in orchards throughout the entire state. And so my work was more, um, where I would need to take a trip for a day, uh, sometimes even overnight. And, um, so then I, you know, rely on my, um, friends and community to help me out with, with babysitting and things like that to fill in those hours. Um, but the day-to-day I can mostly fit my work in, in the lab, um, during, you know, nine to five hours. And so I really try to stick to that sort of schedule. I don’t really have, um, work that requires me to be here on the weekends. Not that I don’t ever work weekends, but I, you know, I don’t have those sorts of, uh, requirements for the type of work that I do. So usually it’s, you know, there are days where I’m gone for a couple days and have to be out in the field. Um, and my work is, the bulk of my work right now is about three hours away from, it’s in the Columbia River Gorge and I’m located in Corvallis, and so there’s some logistics to work out there. Um, but most of it on the day to day, that’s more of a, an exception. Most of my work day to day is from nine to five.

Emily (11:02): Yeah. So it sounds like you are able to kind of manage your hours so you’re not, I guess I always, maybe I wasn’t so good at time management when I was in graduate school, <laugh>, but, um, you know, there were plenty of times when I would stay into the evening, keep working if I had an experiment that I really needed to set up, you know, maybe I would underestimate the amount of time I would take. And I didn’t have children at the time, so I was, you know, free to <laugh> let my work run over if I needed to. But I, I did observe that the people in my lab, um, and in my department who are parents kept pretty strict, um, work hours and I assume it had to do with childcare. Um, so that’s great that your work has, you’ve made it at least lend itself most of the time to, you know, be able to keep hours that are compatible with the childcare you’ve set up.

Lauri (11:44): Yes. And, and thankfully, I think another piece that comes with that is I, um, I have an incredibly supportive advisor who, who understands my situation and, um, never puts me in a position where I feel like I have to compromise being a parent for being a student. And so I think, um, I’m very fortunate in that.

Emily (12:04): Is this something that you talked about during your interviews? Like you were vetting the people who you were interviewing with on this, on this aspect?

Lauri (12:13): Um, I wasn’t, it wasn’t a secret that I was a parent, and so, um, it wasn’t something that I was specifically looking for. Um, maybe in retrospect I definitely should have done that. I think it was more, it, it just happened to work out and I got myself into good situation, but I would definitely encourage <laugh> other people who, who might be a, a student parent considering graduate school to definitely consider that because I know other student parents who, um, haven’t been quite so fortunate in, in their situation. So I think for me, I wasn’t specifically looking for that, even though I probably should have been. Um, but my advisor knew that I was a mom and so at least you know that that information was, was out there and so he, he could consider that fully before taking me on as a student.

Tell us about your service experience on advisory boards and committees.

Emily (13:05): You mentioned earlier that, um, you’re serving on some kind of, um, board or council or something. Can you tell me more about that?

Lauri (13:12): Sure. So, um, I’ve taken advantage of a lot of the resources through the family resource center with the childcare stipend and with the, um, free childcare on campus. And, um, you know, there were, they were asking for people to join the family resources advisory board. And so I, I thought this would be a great place for me to get more involved and, um, sort of advocate for students and, um, I have, you know, have my voice heard and be able to share, uh, the perspective of other students that, um, other student parents in the graduate program. And so I serve on the Family Resources board in that regard. And that group, um, works together to decide on the budget, um, for the, uh, student fees and where those student fees, uh, where that funding goes, um, under the umbrella of the Family resource center. And, um, so that’s for the, um, childcare assistance stipend for different activities for students, um, with families on campus.

Lauri (14:22): And actually that also includes, um, employees with, um, dependents as well. And then more recently, because my involvement on that board, I am the, uh, graduate student representative on another committee for children, youth and families that is a part of the faculty Senate. And the really neat thing about that committee is that we report directly to the president of the university. And so, um, there’s really, uh, a lot of power there. And, um, I guess it’s, it’s inspiring to be a part of that because I feel like we can really make some changes, um, on the university level. And that one is really focused, um, focused students and faculty with dependents and so not just, um, not just children, you know. So we’re also looking at elder care and we’re looking at, um, folks who may have, um, adult dependents and all these different situations that people may find themselves in where they might need assistance because, um, you know, we want to cultivate this culture of care at the university, and, um, that includes being able to support the students and faculty in whatever life situation they might have going on.

Emily (15:52): Yeah, I’ve been reading, um, you know, there’s been more and more I think of the news about this issue of, you know, uh, parental leave right after a birth or, you know, yeah. Ongoing childcare assistance. And then as you mentioned, people, even if they don’t have children, <laugh>, they have other families and like plenty of people do, you know, need to care for, um, parents or other kinds of relatives as they age. And it really, like having your employer, um, be sensitive to these issues and have official programs in place can just make it so much, I mean, it really keeps people in the workforce honestly. Like, I don’t know if you’ve like thought about this, but the likelihood, I mean, half of people, half of people drop out of PhD programs, right? And so like you have extra challenges, um, logistical and financial and so forth, and like, would you be finishing your degree or on track to finish your degree if you didn’t have such a supportive, um, environment? It’s totally worth considering, um, going into graduate school if you already have children or if that’s something you’re interested, you know, in starting a family during graduate school. It’s just, I’m really glad that you found your way into a good situation and are working still to improve it for yourself and for other people at the university. So, you know, thank you for your work on that.

Commercial

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What strategies do you use to keep expenses down?

Emily (17:34): Let’s move on to kind of, um, the, the numbers again, right? So when we spoke before, uh, this interview, you told me you had a laundry list of different strategies you were using to keep your expenses down and to take advantages of, you know, take advantage of programs available to you. So let’s start talking about that. Like, how are you making this work or, or almost work on, on a yearly basis?

Lauri (18:00): Yeah, so I think the, the first thing to think about is that I had to come to a point where I, um, needed to let go of the stigma. The stigma of, um, asking for help and needing help. So before coming to graduate school, I had a, a stable position. I was, you know, working in the industry, I had a, you know, an income that could, um, support me and, and my daughter. And so coming to graduate school and having a drastic change in income was a, a bit of a challenge for me, I think one to accept, um, but, and then two, to deal with <laugh>. But I think once I got over the fact that like, you know, this is, this is the season of my life and right now in order for me to achieve this goal of getting a PhD, I need to, um, take advantage of all the help I can get.

Lauri (19:00): And so some of those resources, you know, I already mentioned some of the ones at OSU, there are also, um, other programs at OSU to help with, uh, food assistance. So there’s a food bank on campus. And, um, I have, um, taken advantage of that. And so I think I, I think there’s a certain stigma there of like, you know, actually taking yourself to a food bank is kind of like a bit of a hurdle to get over for some people. And, um, I guess I’ve just learned to embrace that this is just where I’m at right now.

Emily (19:32): I’ve heard about food insecurity, um, for graduate students on other campuses across the, the, this, the country. Um, and it’s not just people with families, right? I mean, there’s all kinds of reasons why your stipend would be insufficient for your living expenses, where, you know, maybe you can just make rent and do like nothing else. And so it’s an unfortunately very, I I don’t wanna say very, it’s an unfortunate, it’s an all too common issue. Um, and food banks are something that, you know, universities, um, have started and it’s great that they’re trying to help out a bit. Um, like you said, I think it would be hard to get past, um, the, to admit to yourself, I need this kind of help. Um, but you know, you like, especially for you with a child, like you have to put that food on the table for your child. And so you’re doing, you’re doing what it takes.

Lauri (20:23): And I think, I mean, you brought up a great point with the rent. You know, my well over half my income is in rent, and so that’s something that I can’t really change right now. There’s, there’s not really a way for me to, um, make that better. And so one way that I can supplement my income is, you know, in, in food assistance. And so, you know, I do get some funding through the Snap, uh, program or the food stamps program, um, there, and then, you know, if I need it, I will, I will go to the food bank on campus, or I will go to the food bank in the, um, in my community as well. And, um, you know, I think that <laugh> I think it takes a lot even for me right now to admit that, that that’s a thing. But you know, like I said, that’s just where I’m at right now. Um, there’s also, you know, plenty of opportunities on campus to, you know, go to a luncheon or get a free meal here and there. One thing that OSU does is they have a Twitter handle that is @eatfreeOSU. And whenever there’s an event on campus, you know, there’s pretty much always leftover food. They will post that and where it’s at, and then people can go and, um, take advantage of that. So I think that’s,

Emily (21:35): That’s such a great idea. Yeah. I’ve actually asked in, you know, some of the, the previous podcast episodes, I’ve asked people, how do you find out about food free food on your campus? And usually there’s not, I haven’t, I’ve not so far gotten a centralized answer like that. So this is something that all universities should have, right? A central place where everyone can say, Hey, you know, Twitter handle, there’s food here, and they can, you know, uh, amplify that. And that’s a great idea. It’s actually kind, it’s a little bit funny because I feel like graduate students are totally shameless about grabbing their free food from the seminars, and yet you’re right, there would be a stigma to go into the food bank. And you know what, for some people they need that free food at the seminars, um, but maybe there isn’t a food bank available to them. Very, very little difference in, um, uh, function, I guess. But big difference in getting yourself, I think, to, to veil yourself of it. That’s kind of interesting. I wanted to go back to, you mentioned the SNAP program, and I’ve seen this question, I’ve, I’ve received this question before about how do you actually apply for and get snap and what are the qualifications, for instance, you know, for your city or, or whoever’s administering the program, like how did you actually go about, you know, obtaining that benefit?

Lauri (22:43): Um, initially I applied online, so that was a fairly easy process. There’s, um, there’s an interview involved that can be done over the phone. And then, um, I mean, I’ve been doing this for a little while now, and so, you know, you’ll go through your periods of where you have to prove your income. So, you know, initially you have to give, um, proof of income and then every, um, I think it might be every six month, it six months, at least annually, unless there’s a change in between, you have to show proof of income and then your, um, benefit will be recalculated. So I honestly don’t know exactly the details of my qualifications right now because I actually think it’s the, uh, funding we receive. The benefit we, we receive is for my daughter and not really for me. And I know that there’s some, um, complications with students getting, uh, funding through snap, but definitely something to look into, I know. Um, so you can look online for those sorts of forms, at least in the state of Oregon. And also our Human Services resource center, which does a lot of these, um, programs that Twitter handle and the food bank. They also, um, are very helpful with getting students to apply for SNAP and seeing what their benefits might be.

Emily (24:04): Great idea to look to, to that kind of centralized place on campus for, for that kind of help, because it can be really difficult to navigate. Wow. You know, it’s clear my stipend is not sufficient either because a family situation or just because some programs don’t pay enough. Um, so there’s a lot of students kind of in the same boat, and so it’s really good that they have a centralized place that you can go to. I don’t know that that would be the case across all campuses, but at least worth checking out. Um, okay, so back to your, your frugal strategies that you employ.

Lauri (24:33): Um, so another one through the Human, um, resources Center is a Mealbux program. So this is not government assistance, this is through the university, also funded by student fees, I believe. But you can apply every year and actually every term, and you, um, there’s no proof of income. You just fill out this questionnaire about your, you know, financial situation and your food insecurity situation. And then, um, based on that information funds will either be, um, you’ll either be accepted into the program or not, and then if you are, funds will be put on your student ID card to be used at the different food locations around campus.

Emily (25:18): So this, unlike Snap, this is for you, right? It’s not, I mean, your daughter’s involved in the calculation, but it’s not really for her. Like the SNAP is for her, this is for you

Lauri (25:27): On campus. Yeah. And you know, some of the questions that they ask in this questionnaire is like, would this make it, um, you know, they ask, have you gone hungry? And things like that. But it’s also like, would this make it easier for you to study, um, in a group or, um, not feel, um, bad about going to grab a cup of coffee when you’re on campus or, you know, to, so that you’re, you have that sense of belonging and that you don’t, um, so when you’re studying with your friends or whatever, like you can participate and not feel bad about that. Um,

Emily (26:01): Yeah, excellent point.

Lauri (26:03): Yeah. Um, so, so really as you can see, I pull from everywhere <laugh> to get all the help I, I can. Um, I recently just moved my daughter to a school that’s closer to our home, and with that, she also, um, can participate in the free lunch program, which was not available at her other school. So that’s also another benefit to us. Again, a lot of these things right here are focused around food, but if that’s one place where I can get help because I can’t in other areas, then that’s what I, uh, take advantage of.

Emily (26:39): Exactly. And food is a major, I mean, it’s a top expense anyway for graduate students. And you, I think you already mentioned that you either don’t have a car or don’t spend much in that area of transportation.

Lauri (26:49): I, I have a car, um, but it, it’s very old <laugh>, so I don’t have a car payment. Um, but I do, I do try to use my bicycle and really my car could die any day, so yeah,

Emily (27:01): You’ve already, you’ve already minimized that category as much as it’s gonna get. But yeah, the food is one that’s, um, until you get into these assistance programs, it’s after you reach a certain point, it’s pretty hard to minimize it any further.

Lauri (27:12): Right. Um, the other couple other things that are more, less related to food, but just, um, some community resources that I think are probably available, um, in many different communities. Um, our local parks and recreation department has scholarships available, and so I’ve applied for that, um, both for me and my daughter. And so that has allowed us to get a membership to the community pool so we can go there and enjoy that. We can also have a little bit of funding to take classes so I can use that, um, for her to go to a dance class or painting class or whatever, you know, to just, you know, something a little extra that I wouldn’t be able to afford otherwise. So that, I think it’s really great that our, uh, community has that available. Um, and then also we’ve taken advantage of some of the Arts for all programs, which, um, I don’t know if this is specific to Oregon or not, but, um, it’s a way to get, uh, inexpensive tickets to go to the theater or go experience different, um, arts and cultural events that maybe, you know, we wouldn’t be able to afford otherwise, but, you know, I can afford a, a $5 ticket here and there to go do something like that.

Lauri (28:25): So I think my main point there is like, um, to be aware that there are resources out there like that, and again, to just not be afraid to, you know, apply for help and apply for scholarships, because sometimes that’s just what you need to do. And so I think it, it makes me feel good that I can still, you know, give my daughter some of these opportunities that, you know, I really can’t afford on my own, but my, um, community makes that available for me.

Emily (28:54): Yeah, that’s, um, that’s really fantastic. And I think maybe one of the differences between your situation, you know, I, you’re on this grad stipend, you kind of know it’s gonna be five years-ish, you know, maybe more. Um, it’s gonna be a pretty much a static level. There’s not a lot of, um, hope to increase that income in terms of, you know, from that primary job. Maybe that’s different from people who find themselves, um, you know, temporarily at a, at a lower income, like maybe ’cause of job loss or something they might not have really. Maybe they think their situation’s gonna change soon enough that they don’t start looking into these other kinds of programs, but, you know, hey, this is the situation like indefinitely pretty much. So yeah, it makes sense that you’ve, you’ve taken the time to investigate and I really appreciate you sharing all of that, you know, knowledge that you’ve gained, you know, with my audience because I think both, both parents and non-parents alike, you know, uh, can benefit from this in, in terms of looking the way that you have in their own communities and at their own universities for this kind of assistance.

Emily (29:53): Um, was there anything else in that sort of for frugality category there?

Lauri (29:58): Um, I think, I think that’s about it there that I can think of. But, you know, I’m always looking for <laugh>, whatever’s available, and I’m, you know, I’m not afraid to, uh, take advantage of that.

Why have you chosen to this frugal strategy instead of taking out student loans?

Emily (30:12): So why, um, you know, we’ve spoken about how you know, what your stipend level is, which, uh, again, from the living wage calculator, that’s pretty much right in line with what a single person would need to support just themselves. So you’re <laugh> supporting two people on that level of income. Um, why have you chosen to go this route of asking for, you know, food assistance, for example, rather than just taking out student loans? Because as a student you can do that. It is there available to you. So why have you endeavored to make your ends meet instead of going the debt route?

Lauri (30:50): So I think, um, first of all, I have some debt from being an undergraduate, and so that is all being deferred right now, so I don’t have to really worry about that, but that is looming over me. And so I don’t want to contribute any more to that <laugh> than I absolutely have to. And I did take out a little bit of student loans when we moved out here just to kind of help with that transition time. But I have this, you know, $30,000 weight on top of me and I, um, I, I just, I really would rather make sacrifices than, uh, contribute more to that. And I think another piece with that is that, you know, I, I used to have, um, I used to make a living wage <laugh> and be comfortable. And when I came back to graduate school, it wasn’t my goal to go to graduate school and get a degree and increase my wages substantially.

Lauri (31:55): So I, you know, in my field in plant pathology, it’s not, especially for what I do in applied work and extension, um, it’s not really known for high wages and especially if my first job out of graduate school is a postdoc position or something along those lines, um, it, I will be making similar wages to what I left in my current, at my job before graduate school that I had with just a bachelor’s degree. So for me, coming to graduate school was more about the education and the fulfillment and the opportunity, um, and not so much about an increase in salary. So when I leave here, I won’t necessarily be making a lot of money that would allow me to contribute greatly to, um, pay off the debt.

Emily (32:45): Yeah. I think, um, with that sort of, you know, you’re trying to be realistic right? About your salary prospects, um, there you are choosing to make a sacrifice now, but the thing is, like the other choice with the debt is to sacrifice later. Like, it’s still gonna be challenging even with a higher income to pay back the debt you already have plus whatever you, you could have accumulated if you hadn’t been sacrificing so much in the, in the, you know, for the time being. So it’s gonna be hard now. It’s gonna be hard later. It’s gonna be hard all this time. I, I mean, you’re not really, um, there’s not an easy path. Even taking on debt doesn’t create an easy path for you. Yeah, maybe it would be okay or justifiable if you had a huge increase in income after the PhD, but no one’s guaranteed that <laugh>, even if it’s, um, what you hope, hope will happen.

Emily (33:32): So especially with like postdocs, I mean, that’s a long time to keep your, uh, to keep accumulating debt before getting to that like payoff salary. So I think you’re being very prudent, even though it’s very challenging, um, for the time being. So I definitely, you know, commend you for making this goal and for doing everything you can to, to meet it, to meet it, um, through your time in graduate school.

Final Comments

Emily (33:52): So do you have any kind of final thoughts or final encouragement for, um, the parents or the single parents, uh, in academia, in the audience?

Lauri (34:02): I mean, I guess just like I’ve said, like don’t, don’t be afraid to take advantage of, um, your resources and to really search those out and, and talk to people and, and to get involved. Because once you start, I guess, um, sort of diving into what resources might be available to you, you’ll become more aware of other ones. And also, you know, it, I think it’s totally worth the sacrifices and I, um, am very happy doing graduate school and being in a graduate program, even though financially it is a challenge. And so I guess don’t give up on your dreams, even though there might be, um, some things to make that a little bit more difficult along the way.

Emily (34:47): Yeah. Some hurdles to overcome. Yeah. Well, thank you so much for, for this conversation and for your thoughts, Lauri.

Lauri (34:52): Thanks.

Outro

Emily (34:55): Lauri, thank you so much for being my guest on the podcast today. The show notes for this episode are at pfforphds.com/S2E1. If you wanna get in touch with me, you can email me at [email protected] or if I’m me on Twitter at pfforPhDs or Facebook personal finance for PhDs. If you’d like to receive updates on new podcast episodes and other content, go to pfforphds.com/subscribe. See you in the next episode. The music is Stages of Awakening by Poddington Bear from the free Music Archive and is shared under CC by NC Podcast. Editing and show notes creation by Jewel Lipps.